[SiLo]

Quote

Greetings,

I have seen the game's religion structure fall apart in the most recent of Deochs and I have realized why. Each religion does not have "equally good" benefits.

Take the Fiosachd religion for example. They boast a nice entreaty that lets them get gold, the most valuable resource in the game.

Now take Deoch or Ceannlaidir. They can't do much of anything that is nearly worth as much as gold; therefore no one wants to be part of those fellowships.

Ceannlaidir used to be know for its Creag neart, which is now a common priest spell. Deoch was known for curing scars and Suomi scrolls, but people choose Glioca over Deoch because the outweighted benefits.

Glioca can cure scars, cast invincibility (dia dion), heal immensely (dia ioc), and even resurrect. They can also make red potions for reviving fallen group members. Why would anyone choose Cail or Deoch over Glioca?

Cail used to be known for pure warriors due to Stone Fist entreaty making them bash better, but that is now even diminishing due to the change of Claw Fist.

Sgrios is now worthless of a religion because they offer nothing but a quest item (prayer necklace for Nightmare quest). They used to be feared and infamous for their hostile summons that possed a challenge, but no longer.

Evil roleplayers used to exist in the older days, when Sgrios summons were hostile and created quite a scene. It's just so dull of a gameplay experience with just "good" and no "evil."

Now, there is a fine line between "evil" and "annoying" (punishable by the Terms of Service), so it is a touchy situation.

Sgrios summons need to be hostile again and stronger than before (due to Masters and GMs now, along with Medenian classes). This would create the same older feel of lingering evil. The summoner should be killable by players (with the ascension mask) still.

As far as "rules" go for these summons, I believe player politics should still have the power to banish or exile murderers, but Rangers should not jail them.

Jailing should be used only for things that are against the ToS, and not get in the way of the natural gameplay elements. If a player is abusing a bug to murder, then jail is sufficient, but not for normal player murders.

Another really huge issue is that the Mileth altar for ascension and the temple of choosing for buying stats/sub-pathing is in Mileth. If a player is banished or exiled from Mileth, they cannot advance their character.

This is a very unfair punishment because that gives Mileth an advantage over Rucesion politics because Rucesion has nothing worthy of "fearing to be banished from." People don't care about Rucesion banishments, while they fear Mileth.

I suggest that either the altar be moved a neutral location (such as Undine or Suomi) along with the Temple of Choosing. If this is not plausible, then another one should be created somewhere neutral to keep Mileth government in check.

Also, I would highly suggest that Mileth is not the default citizenship. It is not fair to Mileth that newly created players are already citizens of the city, while Rucesion and Tagor citizens have to do work to become citizens of their respective city.

Newly created players should have no citizenship and should have work equally hard as everyone else to become a citizen of a town. This also helps to prevent "newbie guards" in Mileth, which occurs for this reason.

Other religions need to be tweaked to be made "as good" as the others. Luthuas and Gramail have no real use as far as entreats go with the removal of Bend Space eons ago. They should be given newer, more useful entreats such as "Heighten Magic Resistance" for Gramail and "Increased Magic Power" for Luthuas (making spell damage do far more). Ceannlaidir should offer something good for bashers, such as "Increased Melee Power" or maybe even "Hasten" for faster attack.

I will come to a close with some advice. When your game is frustrating to the max, people look for an outlet to cheat or hack. People want to advance their characters or complete a quest like they do in other MMOs. When you easily frustrate people (Dark Artifacts quest) or prevent them (banish/exile from Mileth preventing sub-pathing or ascension), you make them want to hack or bypass the game because they are annoyed. People will do this in every situation, but you can prevent many, such as not having Mileth able to prevent this (move/copy the temple and altar) and making the Artifacts a bit easier to obtain.

Hello,

Thank you for your input. If we feel your suggestion is well planned and appropriate for Dark Ages we will strongly consider it for implementation. Thank you again.

DA Team



Hey, it sounded more sincere! XD

[trrrravis]

sounded automated like who ever got the mail noticed what it was about, sent that automated message, and got thrown in the pile for a boring day.

[Evotyr]

You're right. It did sound more sincere. It would be cool for the religions to be improved, they've been long overdue.

[Zemfira]

Quote

Jailing should be used only for things that are against the ToS, and not get in the way of the natural gameplay elements. If a player is abusing a bug to murder, then jail is sufficient, but not for normal player murders.

I've yet to jail for murder. I've had a hand in having someone blocked for mass murder (at least I think the person was blocked...hard to tell sometimes). You pretty much have to be an ass and mass murder for non-rp reasons to get jailed for it.

Edit: Hehe, no filter for one word.

This post has been edited by Zemfira: 31 August 2005 - 05:31 PM

[Vredick]

Minus the new players not being part of Mileth, it's not a bad ticket. Mileth is where everything is for noobs.

[Irving]

I like it except newbies not having Mileth Citizenship.

[Leos]

Zemfira, on Sep 1 2005, 02:30 AM, said:

I've yet to jail for murder.  I've had a hand in having someone blocked for mass murder (at least I think the person was blocked...hard to tell sometimes).  You pretty much have to be an ass and mass murder for non-rp reasons to get jailed for it.

Edit:  Hehe, no filter for one word.

Yeah but even that shouldn't happen. If someone's managed to raise themselves to the status of 'Mass murderer' all that means is there's been no one good enough to stop that person up to that point. Whether a Ranger should get involved or not should not be defined by the quantity of idiots killed. How do you know they're not roleplaying just because they've killed loads of people? Why does it matter? If it does matter how do you know whether someone who only kills one or two people is roleplaying or not?

To me, when something becomes mass murder it becomes an event of sorts, (it always did in MYDA.) Stopping that completely ruins the fun (even the people on the ass end of the ass kicking will look at it that way eventually, unless they're the types who are born with sticks in their anuses.)

If someone is using only the mechanics legitimately provided to them by the game (I.e not a bug,) Rangers shouldn't get involved unless they want to play properly and help kill the murderers monsters.

EDIT: Added quote, opinion++;

This post has been edited by Leos: 31 August 2005 - 05:54 PM

[_sl0t_]

I don't want to kill your hopes but I received the exact same answer when I asked to let us make a molten empowered ring every deoch instead of only one.

[Irving]

If I ever murder I put a deathmask on.

[SiLo]

_sl0t_, on Aug 31 2005, 09:55 PM, said:

I don't want to kill your hopes but I received the exact same answer when I asked to let us make a molten empowered ring every deoch instead of only one.

Do you HONESTLY think I even expected THIS much of a response? :o

[Zyphone]

I like your ideas Silo, but the way Kru handle the idea's we put forward to them is just ridiculous, as they said 'IF we feel your suggestion' which is an obvious no from them. No wonder people quit dark ages or find it boring a lot of the time. It's because Kru are not taking ideas from the people who are actually playing the game, they live in another [filtered]ing world.

[Ashley]

I just have to chuckle to myself.

;)

[Moiraine]

Sounds like they're getting right on that one.


In all seriousness though, I do agree with your ideas in principle. When I had sent in my bug list for the religious supplications, I had mentioned how the various religions were unbalanced in both the number and usefulness of their supplications. Hopefully they will do something to beef them up at some point.

[Agrus]

Very well writen. It's to bad it'll never happen.

[Krodis]

Hell, if someone went on a mass murdering spree for non-rp'ing reasons, you could rp'ingly justify not having to jail them by saying they were simply rp'ng that they had gone insane!

It all works out in the end!

[enkrypter]

Who the hell cares if someone gets killed nowadays anyway??!?! it's not like anyone has anything to lose. Damn near every item in the game is unperishable.

[Karito]

I agree with your stuff and as for noob stuff being in mileth make them show up in another town with no government where the new altar and temple will be and put all the crap that no one likes from mileth there maybe make a new town for noobs. Becuase I'm tired of mileth being the noob capital for the univerise.

[Akuhei]

Not being able to ascend/sub/master/advance is the penalty for breaking Mileth law.

Illegal banishments and exiles are done by corrup players, or evil and/or corrupt characters, which can be dealt with by contacting a higher official.

Mileth is fine as it is.

But I do agree with the religion stuff.

[Skee]

The point is that the punishment for being banished/exiled from Mileth is far worse from being exiled from Rucesion.
The only thing bad about being exiled from Rucesion used to be for Priests to finish the Cluais Jewel quest, but that sucks, so, there's no dire need to get

I like all the ideas, it'd be a good thing if they actually changed it

[Selkhit]

I like the Mileth citizenship idea, but I think that little ones should still start in Mileth. It would be too much work on Kru's side to move all the noobie stuff around. The part I agree with is not STARTING with citzenship. Citizenship should be earned, just like in Ruc and Tagor.

[Mosin]

Heh, Sgrios died when Acerbus and Enclave left, shortly after Spor Dusgadh turned into a dead guild. Im the last surviving council and member.Ill tell when the end of the"evil" spark came. When Vanmorgan was finishing up his tests for making High priest, at the end of his mass he made a scene where he was trying to get Enclave to step up and stand beside him and proclaim that Van was ready to become a High Priest. I had been talking with Enclave for the last couple of days, and it was kinda decided that we really didnt belive that Van was ready. Granted he done the tests, just hard to tell the man he failed. Anyway, Enclave refused to stand infront of the mass. Van then threathened to tell the Mundanes about how Ace and En was unfairly choosing who could do what, which was a twisted version of what really happened. Belive it was the next day they just made him a high priest and pretty much the entire guild left at the same time. Thats when evil died. I lived and breathed that temple for a long long time, and since then i havnt went there maybe 4 times. Needless to say, ill always hate Van.

[Irving]

The game and the whole religion is based upon you and your little elitist friends.

[Vredick]

Selkhit, on Sep 1 2005, 06:21 PM, said:

I like the Mileth citizenship idea, but I think that little ones should still start in Mileth.  It would be too much work on Kru's side to move all the noobie stuff around.  The part I agree with is not STARTING with citzenship.  Citizenship should be earned, just like in Ruc and Tagor.

If they weren't citizens, though, they wouldn't start in Mileth. They'd start outside Mileth and they could wander around aimlessly with no mundanes to help them.

[Karito]

Just have them drop em in the mileth in regardless of there citizenship boom solved. Mileth is noob center of the universe and SOMETHING needs to be done about it.

[Mosin]

Sgrios Summon are still hostile by the way, stupid myth.

[Soori]

In regards to Sgrios, I didn't know anyone in the Fellowship when I managed to become an Acolyte due to research and a good roleplay. Elitist? No. Enforcing of good, roleplay standards? Yes.


As far as the proposal, I do like it. The issue with Mileth politics is that a large part of the game relies on access to the Temple of the Veil. By placing access to this resource into the hands of a group of players considered corrupt, you make a lot of issues.

Personally, my solution to this would be moving the Temple of the Veil to a neutral area (as is proposed), then making 3 ToS violations (arrests) to cause banning from the game, which would put a check in for people who commit foul acts.

Of course, this would require a lot of oversight on Kru's part in regards to the Rangers, which they may or may not be willing to do.


I also agree highly with the overpoweredness of some religions. Unfortunately, any changes to this system will be very difficult as far as balancing, but we'll see.

[RikiyuTheNoob]

Well, I think that instead of making ascention and mastery more accessable, you should just put some valuable things in Rucesion.
That way it would be punishment to be banished from there, too. Make some things in Rucesion that there isn't an alternative to in Mileth.
The same with Tagor.. but I suppose I've never seen someone banished from Tagor before.

[SiLo]

Akuhei, on Sep 1 2005, 04:37 PM, said:

Not being able to ascend/sub/master/advance is the penalty for breaking Mileth law.

Illegal banishments and exiles are done by corrup players, or evil and/or corrupt characters, which can be dealt with by contacting a higher official.

Mileth is fine as it is.

But I do agree with the religion stuff.

No, the point I was making is that why should Mileth have that power and not Ruc? Then why should Ruc have that power and not Mileth? See the point? No town should.

Also the point that Mileth may have laws, but laws that prevent main character development are not good for gameplay and prevent "evil" roleplaying.

No one will murder unless they have every spell from Mileth, mastered, subbed, and maxed. Then they don't need Mileth anymore, so the punishment is worthless.

This post has been edited by SiLo: 02 September 2005 - 10:58 AM

[Skee]

If you hunt 4.2b Exp within that 42 days, you'll need Mileth

[Karito]

Just don't hunt use another character? O.o besides if your hunting the max EXP in game in a little more then a month you should probably slow hunting a bit being above "____" isn't that important my friend >.>.